Numbers

CBC/Radio-Canada has filed an application in Federal Court to fight an order directing it to disclose subscriber numbers for its Gem streaming service.

The information commissioner ordered CBC to make available the number of paid subscribers to Gem following an access-to-information request for the data.

CBC/Radio-Canada president Marie-Philippe Bouchard told The Canadian Press the subscriber numbers are sensitive commercial information.

That confidentiality matters when it comes to things like commercial negotiations on bundling Gem with other streaming services, Bouchard added.

The public broadcaster is “charged with making some of our budget out of commercial relationships,” she said.

“And that has to be played according to the rules of the market. And so we’re finding ourselves, with this ruling, uncomfortable with the interpretation.”

In refusing to disclose the numbers, CBC cited exemptions for programming activities and information that could harm its competitive position.

In her final report on the access-to-information complaint, Information Commissioner Caroline Maynard said the subscriber numbers relate to CBC’s programming activities, but they also relate to its general administration — which means the exemption to disclosure does not apply.

Maynard said while “CBC did identify possible harms to its competitive position or to ongoing negotiations, it did not demonstrate that there was a reasonable expectation that these harms could occur, well beyond a mere possibility.”

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The information commissioner’s ruling contradicts the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission’s interpretation of what constitutes “sensitive commercial information,” Bouchard said.

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Bouchard said CBC/Radio-Canada wants the courts to provide clarity on the issue.

CBC launched the Gem streaming service, which has both paid and free versions, in 2018. The paid version, which costs $5.99 a month, includes ad-free on-demand streaming and a stream of CBC’s 24-hour news channel, CBC News Network.

Paid subscribers “are not what makes Gem,” Bouchard said. “Gem is mainly a free-to-user service. And the paid part is really a commodity for people who don’t want advertising.”

CBC does not disclose the number of paid or unpaid subscribers to Gem.

In its notice of application, CBC/Radio-Canada asks the court to set aside the information commissioner’s order and declare that Gem records are exempt from disclosure.

It argues the public broadcaster “operates in a highly competitive environment in which foreign and domestic private and community broadcasters and other digital streamers offer their own programming on their respective distribution platforms.”

Bouchard was pressed on the question Monday afternoon during an appearance at the House of Commons heritage committee.

Conservative MP Kevin Waugh asked Bouchard whether she was “embarrassed” by the number.

“No,” she responded.

“Why don’t you come out and just say, here’s the numbers that we got,” Waugh asked again, telling Bouchard to “give us some numbers.”

Bouchard responded that more than five million people have created an account.

In a later exchange with Waugh, Bouchard said the CRTC allows businesses to “consider that information confidential,” while the information commissioner’s interpretation “says that we have not met the standard for that confidentiality.”

“We want reconciliation between those two interpretations, and that’s why we asked the Federal Court to consider the situation,” she said.

Waugh disagreed, telling Bouchard: “I don’t know what you’re hiding. I really don’t, because you’re a public broadcaster, you’re getting the funds from the public, and you’re not in competition with Bell Media, Crave or any of those.”

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